Allium 2012

Nice ones Dave, A. kurtzianum is one of my favorites.  This thing would still be called A. olympicum if it wasn't for years of my persistent correction of the correct identity; a great little onion  for a trough.  The other is A. carinatum ssp. pulchellum, and easy to grow and commonly grown species, another of my favorites; it's like a rosy-purple counterpart to A. flavum.  Nice to see such lovely plants, we're in the deep freeze here.

Must dash off to work soon, but later I'll split off your post to start a new Allium 2012 topic :D

Lovely onions, Dave.

When does they flower in the northern hemisphere? I am always looking for nice onions to grow at my summerhouse. Ideally they should tolerate some summer drought and flower in late June, July or early August ;)

Late last autumn (2011) seed of Allium ovalifolium (thanks Lori!) germinated.  Wasn't sure whether to overwinter them indoors or unpot and plunge the square soil lump "as is", into a position in the garden.  I chose the latter, and covered the area with wire mesh to keep squirrel digging at bay.  I'm so pleased that they started into growth early and are reaching for the warmth.  I have tried seed of this species at least half a dozen times before (including a few of my own seed from an ex Chen Yi form that is a weak grower and not a "good looker"), but never got germination.  Glad to get started with a form that I believe is more robust and much better looking :D

About 5 years ago, I was given some seedlings from a variegated form of Allium nutans.  Some were all green, others had some variegation, while one was nearly totally white-leaved.  The most boldly variegated one was a weak grower and eventually died, but I do have one that shows some fairly strong variegation, and has finally got to a large enough size to start dividing.  Not sure if this clump is from just one seedling or several grown in together; the variegation is stronger on some leaves more than others.  The flowers are ugly, an insipid few-flowered affair, but the leaf variagation might prove useful for hybridization.

Taken today, 4-7-2012, Allium nutans "variegated form".

Along similar lines, Darrell Probst found a number of purple-striated leaf forms of Allium tricoccum in the woods of central Massachusetts, he shared a couple bulbs with me.  They just came up a couple days ago.

Allium akaka in flower now. In the wild it is completely stemless but elongates in cultivation

Tony wrote:

Allium akaka in flower now. In the wild it is completely stemless but elongates in cultivation

Tony, I have tried a number of times to grow this species, have not succeeded in getting them though more than a year of two (I grow all thse things outside).  I like the twisting foliage in your form. I see that your posted a second form on SRGC.  What is the source of your bulbs or seed?

I have always wondered about the name "akaka", what it the derivation, I can't find anything that equates to it in botanical terms.  Looking up "akaka", I learn that it is a Hawaiian word, and there is a famous waterfall in Hawaii named Akaka Falls.

Another mystery was an Allium posted on the SRGC Forum, named by a nursery named Kwekerij De Schullhorn in the Netherlands.  The plant was labeled Allium 'Eos'.  When questioned about the name, he said is was a photo labeling mistake for Allium 'Cameleon' (apparently that is a French spelling of chameleon).  The story was, this was a plant from Wayne Roderick and that it was an American species.  I doubted that, because the plant had wide hairy leaves; no North American allium species has wide hairy leaves, or hairy leaves of any sort.  Some bulbs were generously shipped to me.

Initially I narrowed down the ID possibilities to A. longanum or A. trifoliatum, closely related species, both are Mediterranean species. Now that my plants are flowering in their second year, taking on the strong white-aging-pink color, I have passed it through the keys again, and now feel confident this is Allium trifoliatum.  The insistance that this must be an American species because it was sent from someone in America is a red herring, the plant characteristics speak for themselves.

I'm pleased to report that this autumn-leaf-sprouting Allium is hardy here, and this year coloring up nicely; it is a very good form of A. trifoliatum.  I believe it is important to establish this, as plants in the Netherlands are sometimes too easily named with a cultivar name and resgistered, but with no understanding about what the underlying species is.

Impressions of Allium trifoliatum 'Cameleon', notice the ants in photo #5, they seem glued to the nectar of this sweet scented onion.  The effect whereby thye white flowers variable age pink is delightful.

Related message history on SRGC:
It all starts here, where I start asking questions about a photo shown labeled as Allium 'Eos', then read the topic down:
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=5164.msg153884#msg153884

http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=5164.msg202959#msg202959

http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=6685.msg208295#msg208295

Mark, you have undertaken some detective work! Very handsome onions to.

Hoy,
I've been growing Allium kurtzianum for many years and find it does best in my unheated alpine house.

Very slow to increase and I nearly lost it a few years ago trying to grow it outside, it did not like the damp, wet winters.

It flowers for me usually in July.  The attached photo from last year was taken on 01/07/2011

Madgardener wrote:

Hoy,
I've been growing Allium kurtzianum for many years and find it does best in my unheated alpine house.

Very slow to increase and I nearly lost it a few years ago trying to grow it outside, it did not like the damp, wet winters.

It flowers for me usually in July.  The attached photo from last year was taken on 01/07/2011

Thanks, Madgardener.

Then I will not try them at home but at my summerhouse where the climate is much better. - if I get hold of some seeds or bulbs!

Mike, excellent patch of Allium kurtzianum, certainly one of the very best and most showy of dwarf Turkish Allium.  I don't find it particularly difficult to grow in the open garden, used to have nice patches of them, and they lasted for years.  But, they won't take being crowded out by other plants, and that is why I eventually lost most of them.

Mark

I have three pots of the Allium akaka. The one shown earlier (pink coloured) is from my own seed which I obtained by crossing my two wild (own collection) plants from Eastern Turkey. The second in the pot is now in flower and is straw coloured.

The one shown attached here (straw coloured) was collected near Kars in 1995 and the other (pink coloured) which has not flowered at Ala dag somewhat earlier.

The two seedlings I have raised have produced one plant of each colour.

A point I would make is these plants in cultivation are quite out of character. In the wild they have prostrate ground hugging leaves and completely stemless flowers. They grow in open steppe and have very high light levels,something unknown here. A picture in the wild is shown in Phillips and Rix 'Bulbs'

I do not know the origin of the name.

They have had a moment of excitement and so seed should be available later if you would like some

A few species in the same group as A. akaka, all grown from seeds:
Allium breviscapum
Allium derderianum
Allium noeanum

Allium elburzense
Allium aff. elburzense
Allium nevskianum
Allium shelkovnikowii

Luc,

What is the range of age in these beauties you regale us with?

You have to count 5+ years from sowing to see the first flowers. These species from the acanthoprason section are rather slow growers.

Luc a tremendous range there and beautifully grown. They seem a lot less leggy than mine and think you must have better light. A really interesting variation.

Wonderful assortment there Luc.  A have a number of these coming along from Kurt Vickery and Pilous seed, but merely as tiny 1-2 year seedlings; all are being grown outside.  I sowed Kurt Vickery's Allium aff. elburzense in two spots, each has about a dozen seedlings.  Only 4-5 years to see what happens.  But then again, I had my first seed-gown plant of Trillium discolor - Pale Form flower from seed I sowed outside in 2006, all one needs is patience.

Patience is what we have.
More species will be flowering size in the next 1-2 years.

A few more grown under glassroof
Allium colchicifolium from Turkey
Allium sp. (ellissii ?) from Iran
Allium materculae var. albiflorum from Iran/Azerbaijan

More beauties Luc, I'm particularly keen to get A. colchicifolium some day, love the contrasting color of dark ovaries with clean white flowers.  My Allium aff. ellisii expired a couple years ago, but I'm happy to have some 2-year seedlings from K. Vickery's "aff. ellisii".  I also have a few 2-year seedlings of A. materculae coming along (not the albiflorum variety), but time will tell whether I shall succeed with these sown-and-grown outdoors.

Is there somebody who can give me some information about A.diclamydeum?

Could I please have some help with this Allium, received as A. meteoricum. I was struck by the rather smart black pedicels:

John85 wrote:

Is there somebody who can give me some information about A.diclamydeum?

John, Allium dichlamydeum is a low elevation coastal Californian species, low in stature and very showy, with deep pink-rose flowers.  Here I can keep it for aabout 2-3 years but it always fizzles out and disappears in my climate, I don't think it is among the hardiest of Allium because of its low coastal native haunts.  There are some good photos showing the plant and its native haunts on the Pacific Bulb Society photo galleries:

Allium dichlamydeum
http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/index.php/AmericanAlliumsTwo

Stephenb wrote:

Could I please have some help with this Allium, received as A. meteoricum. I was struck by the rather smart black pedicels:

Stephen, I'm mystified by that one. Examining the bulbs/roots, is it rhizomatous or a bulbous species?  It's been about 10 years since I grew A. meteoricum (a small bulbous allium that was among my favorites); your plant looks very different, and the black pedicels... mesmerizing!  Do you know the seed source?

Allium schoenoprasum major and A.sch.var sibericum
What is the difference please?

I dug up a clump this evening and enclose a couple more pictures. I've also found out who sent me the seed and have asked if he recognises the plant.

John85 wrote:

Allium schoenoprasum major and A.sch.var sibericum
What is the difference please?

Back in the early 1990s I made a compilation of varieties and taxonomic combinations for Allium schoenoprasum; there are dozens of published varieties and forms, although almost none of them are recognized, they are considered to fall within the natural genetic variability of the species.  Since Allium schoenoprasum has the largest distribution of any allium species (most of the northern hemisphere), it is not unusual I suppose that so many varieties were separately described.

Allium schoenoprasum var. sibiricum Garcke is considered by Dr. Nikolai Friesen in 1996 to be a synonym of A. schoenoprasum.  It was described as a tall robust large-flowered form from Siberia and North America.  The same name, as described by other authors, was identified as a new species in 1988, also by Friesen, as Allium altyncolicum. 

The name "major" must surely be a horticultural concoction of no legitimate meaning, it's not a name that was published. Searching google yields very few results, most likely someone applied the name "major" to a larger growing form of chives.

Stephenb wrote:

I dug up a clump this evening and enclose a couple more pictures. I've also found out who sent me the seed and have asked if he recognises the plant.

I'm still mystified about which allium this could be.  I wonder if the pedicel color carries any diagnostic importance; often pedicel color can vary within a species.  I googled allium "black pedicels" and it came up with our very own previous conversation about some forms of Allium ochotense (typically this is a syn. of A. victorialis) with dark pedicels.  ;)  Allium cernuum has pedicels that range from green, through shades of reddish and purplish, and tones of gray to near black, thus not useful as a diagnostic characteristic in that case.

Very interesting Allium whatever it is.

Must photograph first bloom on an Allium from Kazakhstan from Panayotis Kelaidis' 2010 collecting expedition, it looks akin to A. saxatile, but I think it may be closer to A. kurssanovii.

Here is first bloom on an Allium sp. #215 from Kazakhstan from Panayoti Kelaidis' 2010 collecting expedition; looks like Allium kurssanovii to me.  I once grew A. kurssanovii from a known source, and it was much like A. saxatile, but had smaller flowers in a compact head, and bulbs very close to the surface, with enlarged bulb bases, with leaves that smelled badly when bruised or picked, rather skunky like Nectaroscordum.  This Allium sp. #215 from Kazakhstan has similar characteristics.

Allium sp. #215 from Kazakhstan, aff. A. kurssanovii:

Enlarged bulb bases:

And as a parting shot, here is Allium caeruleum, the excellent form from Denver Botanic Garden... I wish it was more amenable to cultivation, I haven't yet found a spot where it will produce more than a single stem here and there.  

McDonough wrote:

And as a parting shot, here is Allium caeruleum, the excellent form from Denver Botanic Garden... I wish it was more amenable to cultivation, I haven't yet found a spot where it will produce more than a single stem here and there.  

Did you try it to grow from seed ??
a friend of me grows Allium caeruleum for the commerce
but it has still now and then a few bulblets in the flower-head

most clones in the trade here have a lot of bulblets in the flower-head  :(

Roland

bulborum wrote:

Did you try it to grow from seed ??
a friend of me grows Allium caeruleum for the commerce
but it has still now and then a few bulblets in the flower-head

most clones in the trade here have a lot of bulblets in the flower-head  :(

Roland

This an extra fine form of Allium caeruleum that doesn't make any bulbils in the flower head, it is taller growing, with larger heads, and a bright blue color versus the darker blue color of those typically in commerce.  It makes myriad little bulblets at the base of the stalks and around the mother bulb; I have gathered these and replanted them, but they are very slow to increase in size, and only the very largest bulbs will flower.  I wish it would grow more easily, to create a scene similar to the one at Denver Botanic Garden, see gthe photos in this link from 2010.
http://nargs.org/smf/index.php?topic=177.msg1254#msg1254

Fantastic

maybe one day you have some bulblets to swap
I understand that this one is self-sterile ???

Roland

I received this as Allium karelinii (SRGC seed from 2007).

From FOC: Leaves, leaf sheaths, and scape scabrous-denticulate along angles. Fl. Aug.
Meadows, along streams; 2000--2500 m. Xinjiang (Altay Shan, Tarbagatay Shan, Tian Shan) [Kazakhstan, Mongolia, Russia].

It  doesn't feel obviously rough. Suggestions?

If the stems are not scabrid, and obviously so when running one's fingers along the stems, then what you have is Allium schoenoprasum  :(

Basically, A. karelinii is the scabrous phase of A. schoenoprasum (syn. Allium schoenoprasum var. scaberrimum Regel), but it is an accepted species these days.

Mark

Do you know people with nice Allium cernuum selections
I have later in the year seeds from white and soft pink ones
I collected three different colours at Head smashed in buffalo jump (Canada)

Roland

Oh joy, thanks Mark!

Anyway, it looks different to any of my other schoenoprasums and I reckon they are underrated as in the attached bouquet I took a few days ago (judging by the reactions I got when I posted this picture on FB a few days ago)!

Stephenb wrote:

Oh joy, thanks Mark!

Anyway, it looks different to any of my other schoenoprasums and I reckon they are underrated as in the attached bouquet I took a few days ago (judging by the reactions I got when I posted this picture on FB a few days ago)!

Stephen, that bouquet looks good enough to eat  ;)

In case anyone in wondering about the strange place name Roland mentioned, this link descibes the place:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head-Smashed-In_Buffalo_Jump

Stephen

I didn't know there where so many colours selected
I have only the normal , white and he Forescate form
Nice selection
What is FB ???

Roland

FB = Facebook

Thanks Mark

to simple to think of

Stephen

Do you have a link to your FB  ;D site ??

Roland

Roland: It's www.facebook.com/stephen.barstow.7

Catching up with a few alliums...
Allium ovalifolium v. ovalifolium:
   

Allium nutans - still not yet in bloom:
 

Allium ostrowskianum and A. moly:
 

Allium obliquum; Allium giganteum(?):
 

I got lazy with the records one year and failed to note this one on the map... but I think I've come to the right place for an ID... ;)

Allium cernuum and Dianthus fragrans:

Hello Lori

Your Allium giganteum is sure wrong labelled
Here a picture from the real one
see the different shape of the petals

Roland

Thanks, Roland.  If I recall correctly now, I think it's 'Globemaster'... does that fit?  Here's another photo of the same plants:

http://www.pacificbulbsociety.org/pbswiki/index.php/BigBallAlliums

Here is the picture from the real Allium Globemaster
not sure if yours is Allium Globemaster
My picture is a pour plant

yours looks more as Allium Gladiator
The bulbs are easy to recognise
large and flat , double wide as high

The bad story
Allium Gladiator is often sold as Allium Globemaster or A. giganteum in the trade

Roland

The bulbs were planted so long ago that I don't recall the shape... though it certainly sounds memorable and I don't remember planting any alliums that were shaped so unusually ('Gladiator' - "large and flat, double wide as high").  I haven't had any reason to dig them up since, but if I do, I will take note. 

Globemaster also has a "double" flowerstem
it looks if there are two stems stick together

Roland

Anyone know anything about Allium loratum. got a pot full of the bulbs, but no cultural, geographical or indeed any information on it?
TIA

We might as well post a link to the answer to the same question about A. loratum, posted at SRGC, rather than have anyone have to type it all out again:
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=8329.msg252566#msg252566

Just a quick summary for those who might not follow the link, and for added emphasis, Allium loratum, a dwaf high alpine species (10,000-14,000') with white flowers from Tibet and western Himalaya, is NOT in cultivation, although misnamed plants going around under this name are widespread and entrenched in Horticulture for a century.  The plants sold as Allium loratum by the big bulb producers in the Netherlands and specialty bulb growers look like various Melanocrommyum species, much taller and with pink, lavender, to purple flowers.  Oftentimes plants labeled as A. loratum are in fact pinkish-lavender Allium decipiens, a most variable species.  Believers of the horticultural loratum as the true loratum will point to expert bulb growers and well-known and respected bulb producers; but it doesn't matter, the plant in horticulture does not come close to matching the original description.  The leaves of Allium decipiens can be described as "lorate", e.g. having the form of a parallel-edged strap; ligulate, no doubt to some degree responsible for the confusion.

It took nearly a century to correct another misnomer, that of Allium "aflatunense" of horticulture was proven to not be that species, and ultimately the name of A. x hollandicum (and the well known A. x hollandicum 'Purple Sensation') was published to be applied to the plants so well established in horticulture, to make way for the true A. aflatunense.  We still await the true A. loratum to be collected and introduced.

Cheers. Will just have to see what it is,if and when it flowers. Will give the original supplier earache then.  :)

I got this as Allium serra
but I don't believe this is correct

Roland

Roland, this is a nice dwarf reddish form of European to Central Asian Allium paniculatum; I've grown a number of such forms and they're all very good, easy and floriferous. This reddish flowered form goes around misidentified under many different Allium species names. 

I grew Allium serra for about 6-7 years, but like many of the Western American species I've grown here, it dwindled and finally expired several years ago.  Here's what it looks like:

http://calphotos.berkeley.edu/cgi/img_query?where-genre=Plant&where-taxon=Allium+serra

Ahhh

I thought a few years ago already that it looked as Allium paniculatum
but I know this one just as tall plants over 60cm
Thanks for naming it
I think I label it as Allium paniculatum Dwarf Red

Roland

This one is for Mark, Many moons ago I got some seed from the NARGS seed exchange. The one which really got me excited was a packet of Allium seeds from the said person. Well they flowered and as promised they were different.
This is one of the nicest colours.
Sadly they do not come true from seed, usually reverting to the original colour of the type and even worse, they are martyrs to rust. I have been trying for the last few years to regrow the different ones without the rust.

bulborum wrote:

Mark

Do you know people with nice Allium cernuum selections
I have later in the year seeds from white and soft pink ones
I collected three different colours at Head smashed in buffalo jump (Canada)

Roland

Here's a bouquet of most of my cernuums, different colours are now popping up here and there... :)  .....and, yes, Mark, they are nice enough to eat and were nibbled on for several days in their vase!

Indians eat them as leeks or chives
maybe you have a few seeds from the different colours
I can send you some seeds from Head smashed in buffalo jump
the seeds from the white form from Head smashed in buffalo jump
no seeds because of the rain

Roland

Yes, I'll try to save some seed of the different types for you! Would love to have plants that come from Head smashed in buffalo jump :)

I'm so late getting back to these pages, my schedule has been too hectice for weeks.

Palustris, so nice to see the nice color forms of Allium flavum var. tauricum getting around, so fun to get such colors, a very good orange one you have.

Stephen, love the cernuum bouquet.  Most years I study the variable forms of A. cernuum and stellatum in great detail, but I'm afraid this year has been a total wash, not enough time, the weeds in the garden are out of control and depressing, we went from 6 weeks drought, now to repeated tropical downpours, particularly on weekends which is my only chance at actually working in the garden.  You need some white Allium cernuum in your palette, normally I could help, although not this year, I haven't marked anything, the weeds swamp the plants, and the monsoon hot & steamy late summer rains are turning seed pods to mush.  I hope next year is a better yeat.

Example, plants of an Allium sikkimense form I received two years ago was growing well and exceptionally well budded this year.  They recently started showing their blue color in the bud stage, I took pictures. Having lost a gargantuan sugar maple tree in a storm a couple months ago, some of my shady areas are now in full sun, and in the last two weeks with considerable heat and monsoon rains, they fried and steamed into sad drooping buds of mush.

bulborum wrote:

Globemaster also has a "double" flowerstem
it looks if there are two stems stick together

Roland

Mine don't have that characteristic either - just plain round stems.

Then you have a tiny one
Or your bulb was wrong labelled

Roland

This is Allium henryi from China, among the small elite group of "blue-flowered" alliums.  I ordered it from Chen Yi as Allium cyathophorum (my goal was to get the type species A. cyathophorum, rather than the ubiquetous A. cyathophorum var. farreri that goes around and masquerades as dozens of other species).  It turned out to be misidentified, as were all Alliums I tried from Chen Yi, but I'm happy it keyed out to A. henryi, a species that is very rare in cultivation, and among the nice late-summer blooming species.

The plant had previously been under the canopy of a Fringe Tree (Chionanthus) which was largely destroyed by an early snowstorn October 2011 when the tree's leaves were present, causing terrible breakage, the canopy of shade was lost.  On the day of this photograph, it was in the 90s F with glaring sun, thus the photos look washed out, the flowers themselves a bit faded in color too, but it is a nice small Allium with few-flowered widely-spaced light blue flowers and exserted stamens.  The foliage is shiny, flat, arching, and as these narrow-leaved species go, a tad bit broader-leaved than A. sikkimense.  After relentless moonsoon rains and hot steamy heat, many flowers passed without making seed, although a few later florets might produce viable seed (as long as the thunderstorms and deluge rains subside).

Allium henryi, a view of the whole plant, the flowers, and the foliage:

Hopefully this is actually what the label says it is.
Allium wallichii. It has square stems .

Palustris, it looks correct to me.  This is a most variable species, sometimes the heads are somewhat fastigiate and few-flowered, but can be more densely flowered with hemispherical heads as well, here is one such link showing a form that looks like yours.  By the way, there are some near black red forms that are striking.
http://plantsoftibet.lifedesks.org/pages/36677

From our 2010 August Chapter plant sale, I have a seedling grown by one of our members that bloomed this year, bought as Allium daghestanicum.  From what little info I can find it seems right...  At 8.5 inches in a pot with a medium that is very fast draining/drying, it is probably smaller than what it might normally be.  What do you think?

Most flowers have long pistils, but some short(?)
         

Foliage is quite thin for an allium, and stiff.  
         

I drew a cross section of a leaf.
   

Two of my Allium wallichii now in flower

RickR wrote:

From our 2010 August Chapter plant sale, I have a seedling grown by one of our members that bloomed this year, bought as Allium daghestanicum.  From what little info I can find it seems right...  At 8.5 inches in a pot with a medium that is very fast draining/drying, it is probably smaller than what it might normally be.  What do you think?

For decades, what was offered up as Allium daghestanicum in the seed exchanges turned out to be Allium senescens, it was impossible to get the true species. I received seed of the true species from Peter Hanelt in Germany, along with many other accurately named species.  I offered seed of this a number of times, and I'm pleased to see the true species now making the rounds.  So, Rick, your plants look correct.  They do in fact have rather firm leaves, even though very narrow.  The plants can get larger than the dimensions you give, but this species remains a very pleasant late-blooming Allium of modest effect, I like it, and your nicely photographed plants look correct.

Stephenb wrote:

Two of my Allium wallichii now in flower

Two nice forms there Stephen, one looking rather similar to the plant Palustris shows us.  For some reason, this species gives me great difficulties. I once flowered a dark red-black form from a wild collection in China by Darrell Probst, but it died out quickly.  I had lots of seedlings from your seed last year, and these too died out... not sure what I'm doing wrong to grow this one.  I need to keep on trying.

I also have some Allium wallichii seedlings.  I had hoped the ones that seemed to die after a month or so, just went dormant.  I guess I will see, but I am not to hopeful.

Thanks for the confirmation, Mark, regarding Allium daghestanicum.  It seems to constantly run out of water in that pot, and I guess that is what it likes!

While trying to research the species, I came across this PDF: A molecular phylogeny of wild onions.  It has a useful and easily understood phylogeny chart for the genus on pages 1165-66.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=allium+daghestanicum&source=web&c...

Probably one for the Onion Man: I was asked by someone at the Oslo Botanics if I knew this Allium. He wrote:

"I collected it in mid-Yunnan, China. Not a very good photo, it has stolons, no bulb at all, flat leaves. I have tried to key it out from flora of china without any luck. It was flowering in october when I collected it, so late flowering. By the way, it also have sunken midvein, important character in this species I would guess."

Any ideas?

Stephenb wrote:

Probably one for the Onion Man: I was asked by someone at the Oslo Botanics if I knew this Allium. He wrote:

"I collected it in mid-Yunnan, China. Not a very good photo, it has stolons, no bulb at all, flat leaves. I have tried to key it out from flora of china without any luck. It was flowering in october when I collected it, so late flowering. By the way, it also have sunken midvein, important character in this species I would guess."

Any ideas?

My guess is that it is very nice form of Allium mairei, a species with many synonyms such as amabile, yunnanense, and pyrrhorrhizum (among others) testament to its variability.  Flowering time in the wild is given as August-October.

RickR wrote:

Thanks for the confirmation, Mark, regarding Allium daghestanicum.  It seems to constantly run out of water in that pot, and I guess that is what it likes!

While trying to research the species, I came across this PDF: A molecular phylogeny of wild onions.  It has a useful and easily understood phylogeny chart for the genus on pages 1165-66.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=allium+daghestanicum&source=web&c...

Thanks Rick, I don't yet have that technical paper (I do now), and I try to save as many of these as possible. The linear chart is indeed useful to understand the groups of related species.

Thanks, Mark.

Unusual to find Allium cernuum for sale here, but I picked up this nice late flowering floriferous plant at a local garden centre last year!

Stephen, you might actually have an Allium stellatum hybrid there, looks similar to a number of Allium stellatum hybrids I have.  It could also be an A. cernuum hybrid, although I would still peg it as an A. stellatum entity.  I find that Allium stellatum will cross with Allium senescens and related species like nutans, resulting in plants with flower heads packed with many more flowers than normal, robust growth with broader foliage, and unusual square (in section) stems, as yours seems to show.

here just made one a new flower
but just a single plant
not the row

Thanks, Mark, interesting - wonder where this plant originated... I still haven't managed to flower stellatum here so I don't have any experience with it (it's either been wrong or has died although I have a couple which should flower next year).  It's not often grown over here and I've never seen it in botanical gardens. I remember you posted a comparison of stellatum and cernuum. Do you know where that was or, if you have time, just note the most important differences? Is stellatum generally later? The scapes are squarish, yes, more so than cernuum.

I have some seeds from the A. cernuum
which I collected at Head-Smashed-In Buffalo Jump
if one is interested PM me

Roland

A new onion for me: Allium listera flowers now! (I know you have it Mark!) Sadly the leaves are somewhat damaged - guess by what!

...but I don't have it...nudge, nudge... :)

I thought I was the only one who didn't had this beauty  ;D

Roland

Hoy wrote:

A new onion for me: Allium listera flowers now! (I know you have it Mark!) Sadly the leaves are somewhat damaged - guess by what!

Awesome!  Trond, where did you get your seeds or bulbs of this species.  I originally had 3 clones collected by Darrell Probst in China, still have 2 clones, they are markedly different.

For those Allium fans on Facebook, I've been putting up Allium pictures mainly from my garden in a special Allium album, now with some 300 or more pictures:

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150966880345860.471791.655215...
(Sorry, not available anywhere else at the moment, it wasn't planned, it just happened)

Mark, I bought one bulb from Bjørnar last spring (http://planteliste.net/a-d.html). I had almost forgotten that I had it so I was surprised when I saw the flower stem.

Stephen, I'll collect seed if I get any.

Allium flavum:
 

Allium senescens var. glaucum:
 

My goodness Lori, your season is so compressed, here Allium flavum and A. senescens var. glaucum flower months apart, Allium flavum in late June to early July, and A. senescens var. glaucum in late August to September. What is the lovely Antennaria foliage that surrounds the Allium senescens var. glaucum plant, assuming it is an antennaria to begin with.

It is indeed an antennaria and I wish I could tell you which one with confidence - perhaps A. alpina but I'm not sure.  The flowers are white and on short stalks (3-4") and the leaves are quite rounded, which I'm not sure fits with A. alpina:
   
Not being sure of its identity, unfortunately, I did not collect any seeds from it.   ???

Plants of Allium aff. thunbergii DJH (Dan J. Hinkley) is in fine flower on this rainy day. I believe this is actually the closely related A. sacculiferum, a species closely related to thunbergii, with more dense heads of bloom, and stamens that aren't as long.  This goes around as Allium thunbergii DJH 272 as well, the DJH referring to Dan J. Hinkley. In the link below are photos from my same plants taken in autumn 2010, these plants not nearly as mature as the ones pictured below.
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=5766.msg167658#msg167658
(oh, I just noticed, that the photos I posted on SRGC in 2010, are exactly the same day of the year, Sept 29th! A very consistent plant)

Looks fine on a dull day, Mark!

At peak bloom now are two Asian allium species, the purple has been distributed as Allium aff. thunbergii DJH (Dan J. Hinkley), but is likely to actually be Allium sacculiferum.  The white allium is a particularly handsome robust form of Allium thunbergii alba I picked up at a general garden center.  In the first photo, the composition was chosen to show the typical disposition A. thunbergii flowers; lax, flowers facing out and downwards, an informal mop-head, florets with very long stamens; whereas Allium sacculiferum (almost always misidentified as thunbergii) has tight spheres of bloom, shorter pedicels thus smaller inflorescence globes, much higher number of florets per head, among other differences.

Two views of Allium thunbergii alba and purple Allium sacculiferum.  In the first of the three views, if you look closely, a tiny Allium virgunculae is starting to show purple bud color in the lower right.

A closer view of Allium sacculiferum; the saucer-shaped forets are densely packed into spherical heads, better photos than the last ones I showed on a dreary drizzly day.

View of Allium thunbergii alba, with such long and lovely "eyelashes":

It's hard to imagine that Allium thunbergii and Allium sacculiferum could be so easily confused.  It seems so obvious.  Thanks, Mark, for such good identification photos.  My A. thunbergii alba, from a forumist here, should begin blooming any day now.

I have always thought of Alliums as spring and summer blooming bulbs, but obviously I have to reconsider that! Seems I have to make room for some in my garden . . . . Hope they tolerate some autumn rain :-\

Note: Recent posts to Allium 2012 have been split off to create "Allium 2013" topic, follow it here:
http://nargs.org/smf/index.php?topic=1305.msg22139