Allium 2013

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Hoy
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Joined: 2009-12-15

Regarding Allium plummerae,  if it doesn't self seed, is it still reasonably easy from seed? Seems it could take my climate as well!

Mark, I have to admit I had forgotten your excellent article on Alliums!

Trond
Rogaland, Norway - with cool, often rainy summers  (29C max) and mild, often rainy winters (180 cm/year)!

Longma
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Joined: 2012-11-19

Allium narcissiflorum

As the seed matures, the seed head rises from the pendant to fully erect. Thanks for the ID tip Rick. 

Allium narcissiflorum seed head

53.69° N, Dedicated to West Coast Fritillaria, plus three other members of the subgenus Liliorhiza. I grow other Genera, as time permits !

Mark McD
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-12-14

Excellent to see this Ron, the defining characteristic between Allium narcissiflorum and insubricum. I can't help but notice the willow seed fluff in the background, what Salix are we seeing there :-)

Trond, Allium plummerae is easy from seed. My Allium garden is largely a disaster from 2 years of neglect (due to huge time constraints from my past jobs), but it's still growing and might make seed; I hope to start working on salvaging what's left of the garden.

Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA, near the New Hampshire border USDA Zone 5
antennaria at aol.com
 

Mark McD
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-12-14

Allium listera looks rather similar to A. ovalifolium; it came to me as Allium sp collected by Darrell Probst in China, I will show photos of 2 clones. What separates Allium ovalifolium and A. listera, is that A. listera is supposed to have more pronounced petioles to the leaf bases, versus being just a pronounced narrowing, and the base of the leaves in listera have lobes that exceed the petiole connection (slightly cordate).  Most important, in Allium listera, the outer perianth segments are much narrower than inner ones, but in ovalifolium the inner and outer segments are more or less equal.  Otherwise, they are very similar. 
Most photos I've seen of Allium ovalifolium tend to have more open heads with fewer florets, but I'm not sure if that's diagnostic.  My Allium listera plants have a lovely pink color to the pedicels, giving the flower heads a heart of pink, which is charming.

In all the years I've sown them in an attempt to increase my stock, only had 1 seed germinate, which didn't grow past the first year, not sure why it's so dang difficult to germinate.  Got seed 2 years ago of Allium ovalifolium from Lori Skulski, they germinated well and are surviving, looking forward to comparing them.

Here are a bunch of views of the smaller of the two clones of A. listera.  The much larger clone is still in bud, justing starting to open now, always flowers a couple weeks later on taller stems and bigger bloom heads.

Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA, near the New Hampshire border USDA Zone 5
antennaria at aol.com
 

Toole
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Joined: 2010-07-02

Allium listera isn't unattractive Mark .As you say the pink is charming.

Cheers Dave.

Invercargill
Bottom of the South Island New Zealand
Zone 8 maritime climate
1100mm,(40 in),rainfall p.a.
Nil snow cover

Longma
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Mark McD wrote:

Excellent to see this Ron, the defining characteristic between Allium narcissiflorum and insubricum. I can't help but notice the willow seed fluff in the background, what Salix are we seeing there :-)

 

It's Salix reticulata Mark. I've posted a picture of it here -

https://www.nargs.org/forum/groundhugging-shrubs?page=6

53.69° N, Dedicated to West Coast Fritillaria, plus three other members of the subgenus Liliorhiza. I grow other Genera, as time permits !

RickR
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-09-21

Are there general thoughts on the best time to transplant/divide alliums according to type?

For instance: bulbous, rhizomatous, moisture loving, desert, alpine, etc.

Rick Rodich    zone 4a.    Annual precipitation ~24 inches
near Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA

Hoy
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Title: Member
Joined: 2009-12-15

I do also grow what I thought was Allium listera but according to your description it doesn't fit quite. Sorry for the bad pictures but it was a little wind and the long thin stems (35 cm) waved. If necessary I can try to take better pics tomorrow.

 

   

I have also two different plants, one has pink pedicels like Mark's, the other is all white. They flower at the same time (now). As you can see the leaf base is not cordate. Can this be Allium ovalifolium?

 

Trond
Rogaland, Norway - with cool, often rainy summers  (29C max) and mild, often rainy winters (180 cm/year)!

RickR
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-09-21

Allium sikkimense

 

Allium stellatum from seed also, three variations from the same wild population a few counties west of here.  Mostly, these vary in bloom sequence.

       

 

I wasn't sure whether Allium sacculiferum seed would require cold condition.  (Thanks for the seed, Mark!)  I planted them 7 February, place one pot outside and one inside under lights.  I found they germinate readily without a cold treatment.  In fact, the cold temperature put them into a dormancy that the 2 months of cold seemed not sufficient to break.  Only 2 seeds emerged, while from the same number of seeds in just a warm treatment yielded more thann a dozen.  I have a couple already producing a flower stalk in this same season.

Rick Rodich    zone 4a.    Annual precipitation ~24 inches
near Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA

Lori S.
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-10-27

I moved my late blue alliums around a couple of years ago, and have mixed them up.  (It was late in the season when I was burnt-out on record-keeping.)  Mark, could you please tell me if I'm getting these IDs correct:

This one is 14" tall in flower; the flowers seem to be campanulate... Allium sikkimense?   But are the pedicels as short as they should be?

  

This one also seems to have campanulate flowers.  The foliage is 4" tall, and the tallest flower stalks are 6".... another (dwarf) Allium sikkimense?

  

Pretty sure this is Allium cyaneum from the starry flowers and long, exserted stamens; flower stems are 6" tall:

  

Lori
Calgary, Alberta, Canada - Zone 3
-30 C to +30 C (rarely!); elevation ~1130m; annual precipitation ~40 cm

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