Lysimachia lichiangensis

[Lori S.]

Apropos of nothing really, but sort of interesting...
From a quick google, it seems there are a staggering number of mislabelled photos/plants out there, that are claimed to be Lysimachia lichiangensis, but appear instead to be various yellow-flowered Lysimachia spp. (often L. punctata).    (This, even from some nurseries!   )

Here is the eFlora of China description, which describes the flowers as white to pink, for starters:
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=210001190

How surprising!

Photos that might be correct are few and far between, and seem to show only the flower spike or basal seedling leaves - not the entire plant.  Does anyone grow it?  I'd love to see photos of the mature plant.

[McDonough]

Lori, in Flora of China, there is a photo showing your subject plant, with white flowers.
(I include the link for quick access ;-) 
http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=89569&flora_id=800

I chanced upon this message tonight, and was looking at the large number of Lysimachia in China, then stumbled across an exciting "Plants of Tibet" site, which I'll be featuring shortly, and in that site, there was a photo of L. pumila.  These are all new to me, so I'm sure there are some wonderful Chinese species awaiting introduction, or at least a photographic sneak preview.  Here are two links:

Lysimachia pumila
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=200017082
http://plantsoftibet.lifedesks.org/node/2408
http://plantsoftibet.lifedesks.org/image/view/2408/_original

[Lori S.]

Yes, as you mentioned, it seems they have been adding photos to that site, which will be fascinating to go through!  

I came across the photo of L. lichiangensis a few days ago too, coincidentally... and what I grew from seed last year as "Lysimachia lichiangensis" is, I believe, actually Lysimachia yunnanensis (it obligingly bloomed in the first year from seed):


It has very small flowers, unlike the spike of L. lichiangensis; the leaf shape is a little different than photos of L. yunnanensis that I've found, but it seems pretty close...  Oh well.

Isn't L. pumila a charmer!  It may take over from L. ephemerum (which was very pretty but got overwhelmed by the ruffians around it) as my favourite Lysimachia!

[Hoy]

You are quite right, Lori.
I have twice been disappointed with my so called Lysimachia lichiangensis-seed. Both times ended with common punctata. >

[McDonough]

Lori, it's amazing how you get so many things to flower in their first year; I guess starting plants off under lights really pays off.

This thread is reminding me of another Lysimachia that has become hugely popular. I remember when it was introduced as a rare new species that redefined our impression of Lysimachia.  I was at a NARGS annual convention years ago, sitting next to Don Jacobs of Eco Gardens, and he talked enthusiastically about a dwarf Lysimachia he collected on Mt. Omei (Emei) China, it was L. congestiflora.  He introduced two forms, one with a silky reddish color to the leaves (named 'Eco Dark Satin').  Many other forms are now in the trade.

The regular form: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Malphighia2.jpg

I grew it in my Seattle-area garden when I lived in Washington State, and it was a fine semi-low growing plant that spread a few feet. Now, these are grown as bedding annuals and connoisseur annuals or half-hardy perennials for planters (one of the Proven Winners trademarked plants), found in most any garden center and nursery in these parts, even in the florists department of grocery stores.  It is not reliably hardy here, and is rated USDA Zone 6 (I would guess Zone 7).

Images of Lysimachia congestiflora:
http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&sugexp=gsisc&xhr=t&q=lysimachia+congestiflora&cp=24&bav=on.2,or.&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&sa=X&ei=5Op4Tb2LMPKH0QGdjcnVAw&sqi=2&ved=0CC8QsAQ&biw=1280&bih=809

Nursery links:
http://www.lazyssfarm.com/Plants/Perennials/L_files/L_Images/lysimachia_congestiflora_eco_dark_satin.htm
http://www.goodnessgrows.com/id125.html
...a variegated form, with a new trademarked name of Walkabout Sunset (an Australian reference?)
http://www.provenwinners.com/plants/detail.cfm?photoID=6789
...and a purple-leaf form named 'Persian Chocolate'  (a Middle Eastern reference for this Chinese plant!)
http://www.finegardening.com/plantguide/lysimachia-congestiflora-persian-chocolate-moneywort.aspx
http://www.skagitgardens.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=plants.plantDetail&plant_id=181

The risk:
Some Lysimachia are well know for their aggressive spreading by rhizomes.  A species that is hardy here, Lysimachia clethroides, a true beauty with white flowers and graceful wands of bloom that nod at the tip, but it grows like a thug and must be constrained in some way, and is best avoided.  I see it in the FOC species list.
http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&q=Lysimachia+clethroides&bav=on.2,or.&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&sa=X&ei=cvF4TcRb67PRAZz7jO0D&ved=0CCUQsAQ&biw=1280&bih=809

[Lori S.]

L. congestiflora is really attractive, but it's just a "bedding plant" here, unfortunately.
L. clethroides is not a thug here (or at least has not been for me, anyway)... the climate and dryness, I assume, keep it well under control (though I certainly know of its well-deserved reputation in areas like yours where the conditions are more suitable for it).

[McDonough]

L. congestiflora is really attractive, but it's just a "bedding plant" here, unfortunately.
L. clethroides is not a thug here (or at least has not been for me, anyway)... the climate and dryness, I assume, keep it well under control (though I certainly know of its well-deserved reputation in areas like yours where the conditions are more suitable for it).

Even in my Zone 7-8 Seattle area garden, L. congestiflora had a tough time surviving the winter, I believe the Zone 6 rating is overly optimistic and merely helps sell more plants.  

I might actually try planting some L. punctata and L. clethroides in a wild-ish area near my driveway, where they can "duke it out" and fight for space.  I love the look of both, just not their rampant spreading when grown among gentler neighbors.

[Lori S.]

I have not actually observed any rhizomatous spread of my normally-coloured L. punctata plants in over a decade, despite that it is certainly hardier and/or better suited to our conditions than L. clethroides.  I have had a variegated form of L. puncata, the cultivar 'Alexander', get a bit loose and very mildly spreading though.

[Hoy]

I consider L punctata a problematic plant. It spreads rampantly and tolerates both shade and sun with enough moisture. It even survives complete dry-out in the summer, leaves and flowers succumb but not the rhizomes.

[McDonough]

I consider L. punctata a problematic plant. It spreads rampantly and tolerates both shade and sun with enough moisture. It even survives complete dry-out in the summer, leaves and flowers succumb but not the rhizomes.

Trond, I have similar experience with it as you, here it is a "thugaceous" (why is this not a real term ) plant.  I do not grow it here in my current garden, but did in a previous garden, and it wants to conquer its immediate surrounds.

[RickR]

Lysimachia clethroides (Gooseneck Loosestrife) goes rampant here in Minnesota, too.  L. punctata can be tamed if planted in poor, dry soil, allowing it to wilt from time to time, especially if placed with tree root competition.   I imagine the same would happen with L. clethroides.  The "duking it out"  scenario kinda scares me: would I really want the most menacing plant to win?

[cohan]

Some interesting plants here.. are these species all plants of wet/damp areas naturally?

I haven't grown any, I'm only familiar with our two local species-and one of those I saw for the first time last year, and only down one road, so hardly an expert on that even!
Lysimachia thyrsiflora; a fairly common plant, I've seen it only in wet semi/wooded and/or grassy areas.. I think it might grow out in the open as well, but I have seen it in some heavily shaded areas; 20-50cm, sounds about right...

     

Lysimachia ciliata,



I saw for the first time last year, only on one road,  in several spots over a few miles, though likely its around in other places..
its reportedly 40-100cm, though many of those I saw were probably more like 20-30, and surely nothing much more than 40-60, if that.. The first patch I saw was in a damp ditch (roadside) which had recently been cleared of trees/brush, leaving the plants growing among grasses etc.



 Possibly the plants would prefer a bit more shade.  Likely after a bit more time passes, the other vegetation will grow in taller/more densely, and the Lysimachia will feel more comfortable, as it looked in another nearby spot where they were less exposed... growing with Allium, Geranium, etc

[McDonough]

Thanks for highlighting those Lysimachia species Cohan; I more or less forgot about L. ciliata, which is found here and most of North America.  I've never seen L. thyrsiflora before, a most distinctive species, yet it too is native here based on the USDA Plant Profile pages (links below), I learn something every day .  I'll have to keep an eye out for it.  I wonder how such species might perform under garden situations, whether they would become too aggressive and weedy.

Lysimachia thyrsiflora
http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=LYTH2

Lysimachia ciliata
http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=LYCI

[RickR]

The two native Lysimachia spp. we have in Minnesota (L. thyrsiflora and L. quadriflora) are both supposedly moist to wet growers.  I have only seen L. quadriflora myself, and it was definitely in wet conditions.

[cohan]

Mark, I've yet to try either; I have collected seed of L thyrsiflora, but have not sown any; L ciliata I only visited the one time, I did not get back down that road to collect later on....
If I remember correctly, Kristl noted both species as having very limited germination without GA3.. might try them with native, esp wetland, soil...
thyrsiflora at least looks like cuttings might be a possibility as well; it grows on the farm, and even right on my acreage. L ciliata did seem to tend to large stands, no idea how easy it would be to control in the 'garden', but I'd be quite happy to give it a semi-wild area with some of its natural cohorts here--the wild chives it was flowering with in some spots is a nice complement...