Re: Alpines August 2012

[Tim Ingram]

Discussion continued from the Alpines July 2012 thread, here:
http://nargs.org/smf/index.php?topic=1121.msg19011#msg19011


Oh, why do I garden Cliff! What magnificent scenery. So I must have ovina; like the sound of divina.

This plant is one I have tried growing several times unsuccessfully - Bolax gummifer. I have it now in a slightly shaded narrow scree (pure gritty sand) alongside a raised bed, where it seems to be settling down. I love the foliage and it must be one of the most attractive alpine umbels.

[Lori S.]

It's very nice to see Bolax gummifera, especially photographed so well, Tim.  The foliage contrast between it and Azorella trifurcata (which I actually bought as "Bolax gummifera") is quite apparent:


Does your Bolax have white/greenish flowers?

Gentiana gelida:

[cohan]

The one in the background I suppose?

That might be a bit much to garden! Though if it came with flora, I wouldn't need to 

Tim, that Bolax is looking nice and tight!
Lori- cute Gentian

[Tim Ingram]

Lori - I haven't really seen flowers properly on Bolax but they must be very similar to the greenish flowers of Azorella. If you could imagine alpine umbels with really colourful flowers suddenly everyone would be growing them!

The gentian is nice, like a yellow form of septemfida. I have a couple of old books on the genus and there are so many species you never see these days (G. kurroo is an example that always stands out because the name is around but not the plant).

[Bundraba!]

This plant is one I have tried growing several times unsuccessfully - Bolax gummifer.

A British colleague once sent me a tiny piece of this plant which faded away too quickly. I simply adore it and absolutely MUST grow it. Petunia patagonica is another (it lasted more than a year here). Does anyone in the U.S. grow these? Access would be very much appreciated!

[Lori S.]

Lori - I haven't really seen flowers properly on Bolax but they must be very similar to the greenish flowers of Azorella.

The reason I was asking was that I have seen flower colour cited as a distinguishing factor also between Bolax gummerifera (greenish-white flowers) and Azorella trifurcata (yellow flowers, which is very clear on my plant)- see the first comment below on the this misidentified photo (posted as Bolax gummifera but actually Azorella trifurcata):
http://www.botanicalgarden.ubc.ca/potd/2005/11/bolax_gummifera.php

Clearly, Bolax gummifera is a great deal harder to grow, of the two!

The name changes through time for both species may explain the lingering misconception that the two species names are synonymous:
http://www.theplantlist.org/tpl/record/kew-2667511
http://www.theplantlist.org/tpl/record/kew-2678931

[Tim Ingram]

Lori - this probably shows the inherent difference between the rigorous botanical description of plants and I must admit my own observations of growing them as a gardener. In this case growth habit and form is so distinguishing that the two cannot be confused, but this must be because Bolax has been grown for years in the UK and is quite familiar. When it comes to some of the other umbellifers (notoriously difficult plants to identify at times!), the botanical characteristcs become more and more important, and probably more and more up for debate. Species of Lomatium in America certainly seem very difficult to distinguish at times (to say the least), and often location must be as important a consideration as morphological characteristics.

I am aiming to amass more detailed observations on umbels (particularly alpine species) and write about them, but like as much as possible to describe plants from my own experience as a gardener growing them as well as from the literature. The South American species like Azorella and Bolax are really nice plants and many more are being grown, so I imagine even more scope for confusion!

[Booker]

Hi folks,
One from yesterday ...
Gentian purpurea high on the French-Swiss border at Le Tours near Chamonix Mont Blanc with the French peaks in the background.  We have moved on to beautiful Lake Annecy today ... images to follow when time allows.
Kind regards to all.
Thanks Lori, Trond, Cohan and Tim for the very kind remarks.

Plus two images from the high alpine world above Chamonix.
 

[Lori S.]

Beautiful shots, Cliff!

Lori - this probably shows the inherent difference between the rigorous botanical description of plants and I must admit my own observations of growing them as a gardener. In this case growth habit and form is so distinguishing that the two cannot be confused...

Your excellent photo shows that very clearly.  Unfortunately, there does seem to be a lot of confusion out there, for example, this Wiki entry for Bolax gummifera which shows a photo of Azorella trifurcata:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bolax
 

[cohan]

Such a beautiful place, Cliff! Must be hard to leave...
the purpurea is lovely too, especially with the view behind it

[Tim Ingram]

The gentian with the soft sky behind it is very beautiful. I wonder if those meadow gentians are grown much now? I never succeeded very well with lutea.

[Lori S.]

I grow Gentiana lutea but it doesn't bloom every year... as a matter of fact, it hasn't bloomed in some years, unfortunately.    It is a large plant in a spot where it is slowly being encroached upon by a spruce, and is also probably drier than it would like; it needs to be moved, though I'm very hesitant to do so.  I've read that the roots are very large (used for flavoring liqueurs, interestingly), and from the disastrous results of moving much smaller plants years ago, I'm not looking forward to it!
I would love to grow G. purpurea too.  I germinated a couple a while back but had no success at keeping them alive.

[Hoy]

Tim, I successfully grow a meadow gentian - Gentiana purpurea. Unfortunately not in a scenic place like what Cliff shows us (bravo Cliff!) 

G. purpurea is native to Norway but I have introduced it to our cabin in the subalpine zone (950m). I have collected plants from 3 different populations; the nearest not very far from here. They are growing in a meadow, previously used as a pasture. My plants selfsow and the population increase. However, it takes several years before seedlings flower. Seems that seeds germinate easily, at least in situ.

Here are a few of my plants. Notice the difference in flower development; they are from different populations. Seeds ripen late but I can try to collect some if you are interested.

[Tim Ingram]

Nice plants Trond! Yes I would be interested in seed if and when... I wonder if it might be possible to establish this like you have in a grassy sward? I have an area of long grass with bulbs but it might be too much competition. Would be interesting to try good established plants in pots.

[IMYoung]

Re the Bolax gummifera  versus Azorella confusion: Azorella tricuspidata is a synonym for Bolax gummifera, whereas Azorella trifurcata is something else altogether.  
Is there any wonder folks get muddled?!


P.S.  my Bolax is dead..... vine weevils and wet summers, I think, but my Azorella trifurcata is just fine.