Lupinus lepidus var. utahensis

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Lori S.
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-10-27

Really?  The species that occur here grow in alkaline soil... that is not to say they require it, though.  Lupinus polyphyllus grows easily here in alkaline soil too.  There seems to be a few genera/species that actually require specific ranges of pH, but it seems an awful lot of plants are pretty oblivious to pH, in spite of the conditions in their native habitats or what is claimed in the gardening books.

Lori
Calgary, Alberta, Canada - Zone 3
-30 C to +30 C (rarely!); elevation ~1130m; annual precipitation ~40 cm

Anonymous
Title: Guest

Lori,  I rarely see Lupinus polyphyllus hybrids in garden where I liver or where I used to live in the Mohawk River Valley of NY.  However, when I travelled to the White Mountains of New Hampshire this species was growing wild all over the roadsides.  I always attributed their successful colonization to the granite parent material.

James

Hoy
Hoy's picture
Title: Member
Joined: 2009-12-15

Talking about Lupinus polyphyllus: It is blacklisted here in Norway and forbidden to plant but it is too late of course!
The first picture is from Iceland - intended  as a warning :o

http://www.naturoppsyn.no/content/500040669/Lupiner-dekker-landet

the second is from Norway - a common sight along the roads here!

http://www.ranablad.no/nyheter/article5130464.ece

However, I don't think anyone will be mad at me if I grow L. lepidus ;)

Trond
Rogaland, Norway - with cool, often rainy summers  (29C max) and mild, often rainy winters (180 cm/year)!

Weiser
Title: Member
Joined: 2009-12-04

Trond
WOW!!! :o
The old adage holds true "One Man's Weed Is Another Man's FLower"

From the High Desert Steppe
of the Great Basin and the Eastern
Escarpment of the Sierra Nevada Range
Located in Reno/Sparks,NV  zone 6-7
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sierrarainshadow/
John P Weiser

Lori S.
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-10-27

Trond, is the lupin in Iceland (your first photo) actually L. nootkatensis?  I was reading that it is an incredible pest there (though stunningly beautiful), and the white banners on the flowers in the photo look like L. nootkatensis rather than L. polyphyllus.

James wrote:

Lori,  I rarely see Lupinus polyphyllus hybrids in garden where I liver or where I used to live in the Mohawk River Valley of NY.  However, when I travelled to the White Mountains of New Hampshire this species was growing wild all over the roadsides.  I always attributed their successful colonization to the granite parent material.

Surely it's not a bad thing that certain species that run rampant in their "ideal" conditions can also be grown satisfyingly-well in gardens in different conditions without risk of taking over the countryside?  :)
The lupins that occur here are L. argenteus, lepidus (just sneaking across the border), nootkatensis, polyphyllus, pusillus (an annual) and sericeus, and they occur across the southern plains and western mountains, where the soils and groundwater are generally alkaline.  (For example, the Rockies west of here are dominated by vast outcrops of extremely thick carbonate strata.)

Lori
Calgary, Alberta, Canada - Zone 3
-30 C to +30 C (rarely!); elevation ~1130m; annual precipitation ~40 cm

Hoy
Hoy's picture
Title: Member
Joined: 2009-12-15

Lori, you are right. The text doesn't mention which species it is. However, both L. nootkatensis, perennis and polyphyllus are unwanted although they are rather common along the roads and railways.

L. perennis nootkatensis. Sorry - wrong name at the homepage!

From here:

http://www.vestlandsnatur.com/indexfiler/flora.html

Trond
Rogaland, Norway - with cool, often rainy summers  (29C max) and mild, often rainy winters (180 cm/year)!

Lori S.
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-10-27

Hoy wrote:

However, I don't think anyone will be mad at me if I grow L. lepidus ;)

I sent seeds to the NARGS and SRGC seedexes, so there's your chance!

Lori
Calgary, Alberta, Canada - Zone 3
-30 C to +30 C (rarely!); elevation ~1130m; annual precipitation ~40 cm

Hoy
Hoy's picture
Title: Member
Joined: 2009-12-15

Lori wrote:

Hoy wrote:

However, I don't think anyone will be mad at me if I grow L. lepidus ;)

I sent seeds to the NARGS and SRGC seedexes, so there's your chance!

:o ;D ;)

Trond
Rogaland, Norway - with cool, often rainy summers  (29C max) and mild, often rainy winters (180 cm/year)!

externmed
Title: Guest
Joined: 2010-03-01

Quote from: Peter George
I've tried them from seed 10 times, and although I've actually gotten a few flowers one year, they have only wintered over once. I've grown them in sand, in gravel and sand, and pretty much every other soil medium possible, yet they've simply never really liked it here in the northeast. The person who originally introduced me to rock gardening, Larry Rue, built a huge sand berm about 15 feet long, 3 feet wide and 5 feet tall, and had them self sowing on the south face.

I've been thinking a bit about more extreme constructions of rock gardens and what the results might be in unfavorable climates.  There is a granite promontory on NE Cape Ann (Massachusetts) which is partially covered by up to 100 feet of granite quarry tailings.  Every woody plant that grows there is a natural bonsai, except the most exposed areas which are essentially above the "tree line" due to salty winter gales.  (Above the "tree line" at 100 ft elevation, 42.7N 70.6W)  Unfortunately a hundred years is insufficient for the evolution of a new flora.  (Possibly some day some Jobivaras might appear there by unknown means) ;)

Perhaps Peter can give us some more information, about the Larry Rue sand berm with the odd-sounding dimensaions.  Where was it, and what else grew there?

Best regards,
Charles Swanson MA USA z6a +/-   

NE Massachusetts (New England) USA  zone 6 (5B to 6B)

gardens visited, photographs:  www.flickr.com/photos/wildmeadow

Peter George
Title: Member
Joined: 2009-09-03

He had about 4 tons of sand delivered to his house, and laid out a berm that was 15 feet long, 5 feet wide and 5 feet high. He dug a trench that 'outlined' the berm, and started filling it with sand, rock and various inorganic 'stuff' that would fill up space without either deteriorating or absorbing water. It was a massive thing, utterly stupefying when finished, which took him probably 2 months working alone. I helped him a bit when he was at the 3 foot level, primarily helping him place bigger rocks to create ledges and crevices.

When it was done he planted hundreds of cacti, and far too many other plants than I could ever recall. I do remember that he ended up with 4 or 5 enormous Penstemon barrettiae, which flowered spectacularly the first spring after the berm was constructed. He must have sown about 100 Lupine seeds directly into the berm the first year, and most of the seeds germinated, creating a spectacular display the 2nd year when most of them bloomed. The 3rd year there were self-sown seedlings all around, but that was the year he decided to quit Massachusetts and resettle in Virginia, a profound mistake in my opinion.

The berm was primarily laid out east to west lengthwise, with an interesting shaded area at the west end where he grew Lewisia tweedyi, L. cotyledon, and several other choice things that like a bit more shade but need perfect drainage.

Overall it was a magnificent, if briefly present, berm, which for me at least, proved that you could grow western dryland plants here in New England if you took the time and effort to create a 'perfect' environment. It is a shame Larry disappeared, because he was a truly gifted rock gardener.

Peter George, Petersham, MA (north central MA, close to the NH/VT borders), zones 5b and 6 around the property.

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